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1. You needn’t worry Concern Troll Suderman.
   Avatar is a daisy cutter filled with liberal memetics aimed right at these guys…..

   Rated: PG-13

   Its the new Star Wars, and its going to shape culture for the next 20 years. Just like Star Wars was infused with Campbells basal mythology, Cameron has infused world mythos into Avatar.
   Avatar is going to do the same thing Star Wars did 20 years ago.

   All your base are belong to us.

   — matoko_chan · Dec 12, 08:54 PM · #

2. Star Wars might be a bit much, but I could certainly see this doing business like the Lord of the Rings films, which were equally long, equally massive undertakings that hit around Christmas.

   — Peter Suderman · Dec 12, 09:02 PM · #

3. Speaking of Star Wars, the third prequel had a lot of thinly-veiled Iraq content and it did great box office. Personally I doubt that the average movie goer will have the slightest idea that subtext is in there, but I’ll have to wait to see it.

   — Freddie · Dec 12, 09:55 PM · #

4. Was Last of the Mohicans also an anti-Iraq War film? It’s not like the ‘amoral technologically superior empire bossing around the noble natives’ genre was just invented.

   — sidereal · Dec 12, 10:14 PM · #

5. Well, sure — it’s been described as more or less Dances With Wolves on An Alien Planet. But Jeffrey Wells suggests that the politics are more than a subtext (as they were in the Star Wars prequels):

   The political import of Avatar — and there’s no waving this aspect away because it’s right in your face start to finish, and especially in the third act — is ardently left. It is pro-indigenous native, anti-corporate, anti-imperialist, anti-U.S. Iraq War effort, anti-U.S.-in-Afghanistan (and anti-troop-surge-in-that-country, or strongly against the thinking of President Barack Obama and Gen. Stanley McChrystal), anti-rightie, anti-Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld, etc.

   — Peter Suderman · Dec 12, 11:05 PM · #

6. Yeah, but I still think it’s a major leap to associate the box-office problems with Lions for Lambs et al. to Avatar.

   — Freddie · Dec 12, 11:07 PM · #

7. No need to guess, Suderman…..Cameron says it is anti-Iraq war.
   Cameron retracted his US citizenship application when Bush was elected.

   There are a lot of Star Wars parallels, basal mythology, innovation, liberal memetics, ground breaking cinematography, layalong console game, first of a trilogy, etc…..
   Cameron—
   We know what it feels like to launch the missiles. We don’t know what it feels like for them to land on our home soil, not in America. I think there’s a moral responsibility to understand that.

   — matoko_chan · Dec 13, 12:51 AM · #

8. Expecting Americans to see subtext is expecting entirely too much.

   BTW: Movies should not be reviewed until they are actually seen. No offense, but when you publicize an as-yet-unseen film, you’re just participating in hype. Now excuse me while I figure out new ways to inject “New Moon” references into my monologue for the next 5 weeks.

   — Ray Butlers · Dec 13, 06:11 PM · #

9. These people have already seen it.
   Butlers, Suderman is just trying a feeble pushback against a devasting and visually and technologically gorgeous indictment of conservative “values” targetting the next generation of voters and anyone with a college degree and an IQ over room temperature.
   What are the po’ whittle conservatives to do when the director of highest grossing film of all time declares kanly on their cherished core ideology? That ideology being the souless rapacious exploitation of the little black or brown or red or yellow people……… for their own good.

   hahahaha

   — matoko_chan · Dec 13, 06:58 PM · #

10. Now, I enjoy Hollywood’s prodding of morally-despicable right-wing policies (even though let’s not delude ourselves, the supposedly leftist Dems have often enacted those too), but from what I’ve seen in the trailer, the movie seems like it was written by a high-school kid. Yes, the exteriors are breathtakingly gorgeous, but the plot, the dialogue, the characters and even acting (real and CGI), seem really amateurishly done.

    Much as I would like matoko’s predictions about the “enlightening” of the generations of young people to come true, I’m fairly skeptical. Although, it is possible that kids below 12 might actually be positively affected by the message. But not those who are old enough to be cynical enough.

    — Marko · Dec 13, 07:34 PM · #

11. It’s both amusing and disgusting that people really can’t stomach any dissent at all from the middle/conservative Military Industrial Complex-approved hegemony. Movies in particular and art in general have a terrible track record of changing the overwhelming worldview such as that promoted 24/7 on both “mainstream” and “conservative” media. Dissenters are rarely heard from at all. I’d say that an eight-years-too-late critique of Iraq policy is pretty small potatoes.

    — Ray Butlers · Dec 13, 07:53 PM · #

12. I can imagine an Iraqi seeing this movie and thinking:

    Hey. Who’s a noble savage? My Mesopotamian ancestors were civilized, when European ancestors were still running around eating each other.

    Never confuse Dark Ages with Noble Savagery. Civilizations can fall as well as rise.

    — Keid A · Dec 14, 12:22 AM · #

13. Ahem…
    “Big Hollywood’s modest objective: to change the entertainment industry. To make Hollywood something we can believe in – again. In order to give millions of Americans hope.
    Until conservatives, libertarians and Republicans – who will be the lion’s share of Big Hollywood’s contributors – recognize that (pop) culture is the big prize and that politics is secondary, there will be no victory in this important battle.“ -Andrew Breitbart

    Candidate for Balloonjuice comment of the year—

    Max hats: The whole concept of the much hyped “Big Hollywood” blog is mind blowing. Change the politics of Hollywood with a blog composed of 3rd rate conservative blowhards? Uh, okay. Sure. And I’m going to change NASA through interpretive dance.

    — matoko_chan · Dec 14, 02:57 AM · #

14. “And I’m going to change NASA through interpretive dance”

    You? – No.
    Stanley Kubrick? – Yes.

    — Keid A · Dec 14, 08:33 AM · #

15. Regarding subtexts (or even fairly obvious texts), I remember “Spy” magazine, many years ago, doubtless having observed the many close-reading-impaired concertgoers waving giant American flags during performances of “Born in the USA,” suggested that the Boss entitle his next album “America: I Hate It,” so that his fans would get the message.

    — y81 · Dec 14, 09:42 PM · #

16. y81….
    too soon perhaps for the Boss……but the juke box musical Green Day made on American Idiot is a sellout, and their anti-war anthem 21 Guns won VMA song of the year.
    I’m feeling a sea change.
    I wonder if this what the end of Viet Nam felt like?

    — matoko_chan · Dec 14, 10:34 PM · #

17. matoko_c, A “see change”? Really? I must have missed all those pro WOT movies. Or all those movies that depict the natives as evil, and corporations and “Westerners” as forces of good. And catch up with the time – American Idiot came out in 2004, five years ago. Besides, the rockers have been making anti war and left wing albums for more than 40 years. I love the music. But it hasn’t helped the left. And neither have the movies. If your going to gloat about culture, you should at least have a clue. By the way, the Clash rules, but Green Day (esp. American Idiot) has only made one ok album. At least be a lib with good taste!

    — JC39 · Dec 14, 11:27 PM · #

18. JC39, problem is dude, white protestant WAS the culture, the orthodoxy.
    Lol, ever see a western circa 1950— who were the bad guys? the red men.
    Evuul germans, japs, NORKs.
    A see change.
    That is good.

    The problem is, conservatism is whites only. Like Dr. Manzi’s post and forthcoming book…it is irrelevent to a multi-colored electorate.
    Shorter Manzi— hey! lets use conservative values to fix the problems caused by conservative values!

    — matoko_chan · Dec 15, 08:13 PM · #

19. m_c,
    1950? Are you kidding me? Maybe that works when talking to Buckley’s ghost. Most conversatives I know under the age of 40, love rap, soul, R&B, some blues, etc, though lately there’s been a decline in the quality of all of the above, excluding a few artists. In public schools, movies, etc.., the whole brown = good, white = bad narrative has been promoted our whole, relatively short lives. I don’t think that Avatar has a single original theme on that front. Funny though about Avatar – like all those Dances with [_] type movies, its always the white man who shows the natives how to fight back – they can’t figure it out on their own. Hmmm. However, I do agree with you that the GOP has a problem expanding into non-white groups, but the GOP is also having a problem with me as well…. The GOP just has problems. But sound economic policies and foreign policies can be sold to any group – with the right leadership, something the GOP desperately needs.

    — JC39 · Dec 16, 12:57 AM · #

20. matoko_chan

    The irony is: Many of those “Evuul germans”, the movies of the 1950s were about, were also white Protestants.

    And if you don’t think they were evuul, you should visit here sometime.

    So are you defending the “noble” Nazis now, matoko_chan?
    The Japanese were their allies.
    They attacked the USA. So that means they are “noble” too?
    The Norks are still one of the most vile, repressive regimes on Earth. The UN tried to stop their invasion of the South and remove them, but China prevented it, and supports them still.
    At least the UN, led by America, saved half of Korea from their tyranny, and removed the immediate threat to postwar Japan.
    But the threat grows again, as they acquire missiles and nukes.

    Perhaps the problem is your own values, matoko_chan. You only despise your own (former) culture and everything it ever did or does.

    I dunno Matoko. Many Hispanics are dark-skinned too, you know. You could have “reverted” to Catholicism, moved to CA or TX. Learned Spanish. Lots of hot Hispanic guys.

    Also, I predict Latin America has a terrific future. They are catching up fast, especially Brazil. If US keeps investing there full time, they will boom. China needs their resources too.

    Also, cheap solar energy could eventually transform the tropical Americas and especially Mexico. They’ll need something as the Cantarell oilfield runs out.

    See, I am pessimistic about Islam, on account of their version of right-wing conservatism, which is far more conservative than the US variety.

    But I am very optimistic about Latin-America.

    At least I could understand it if you went Latino.

    — Keid A · Dec 16, 01:45 AM · #

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